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 Post subject: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 11:34 am 
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I'm assuming that in most places, seminary is only offered as an early morning option. When I was a teen in the late 80's, "home study" was also an option for those that couldn't make it due to early activities like band.

Well, I haven't heard much about home study being offered anywhere- is it?- but here in AZ, seminary isn't even offered as an early morning option. No, you can ONLY take it as a release time class. And because of the number of credits needed to graduate here, you can't even fit it into your schedule without paying for a few summer classes to make up for those classes you miss due to release time. You can take a "zero hour" class (one year this can be seminary), to avoid too much summer school.

So how much are we talking?

$175 per 1/2 credit. That's a semester class. So $350 a year for a year long class. Most LDS kids around here take two summer school classes each year to avoid having to do a zero hour class and so they can take release time seminary. Seminary is costing them $350 a year.

And look- the stake has even broken it down for us, so we can see how to work it out that our child can take seminary all four years. It is sickening to me that it is not even an option for seminary to be truly free, yet they push it so hard. When I outright asked dh if they were essentially saying you had to pay for seminary, he kind of agreed with me and thought they were looking at ways to change. I asked why they don't just offer early morning seminary in each ward like normal other towns do and he said there were too many kids. Huh? If you do it by ward it would be quite manageable-- I mean Texans, Kansans, West Virginians, and practically every other state does it just fine.

The bottom line for me though is- why are LDS people not complaining about this expensive program? Why do they just roll over and take it?

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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:05 pm 
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Because it's not the fault of the church. It's the school's fault for having such high requirements. And it's the ACLU's fault for not letting seminary credit count toward graduation as a social studies class.

Mormon students are persecuted for their faith by having to jump through all these hoops to receive religious instruction that really the state should be paying for.

Mormons find a way to feel good about themselves in almost any situation.

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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 8:26 pm 
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In the 90s through the early 00s, the stakes in the west valley definitely did early morning seminary. There was also a home study class one stake over that was open to anyone in the region, but only students with very specific circumstances could do that. I think the release time seminary is an east valley thing. It's odd they wouldn't allow students to do home study or early morning. I think this might be more of a result of someone in charge of CES in that area being over-zealous or something.


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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 11:55 pm 
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trinity3infinity wrote:
In the 90s through the early 00s, the stakes in the west valley definitely did early morning seminary. There was also a home study class one stake over that was open to anyone in the region, but only students with very specific circumstances could do that. I think the release time seminary is an east valley thing. It's odd they wouldn't allow students to do home study or early morning. I think this might be more of a result of someone in charge of CES in that area being over-zealous or something.

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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 11:56 pm 
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Maybe it really is about the money. I mean, if kids are allowed to opt out of release time and do home study or even early morning, they aren't bringing in the same bucks, are they?

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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 8:54 am 
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belaja wrote:
Maybe it really is about the money. I mean, if kids are allowed to opt out of release time and do home study or even early morning, they aren't bringing in the same bucks, are they?


Except the money to pay for summer school or zero hour goes entirely to the school district. Not to the church.

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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:57 am 
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Too many kids? I call bullshit. I taught early morning Seminary in South Carolina. I had twenty kids in my class, and we had another teacher in my ward who had about the same number. The wards are not likely to have many more kids than that; if they do, they can get another teacher and have three or four classes. Doesn't make sense. I'm not buying what they are selling there. The real reason is they know that fewer kids will attend if it is early morning.

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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:27 pm 
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What is the incentive for going to seminary? I never felt like I had to go more than I felt like it -- maybe because my parents weren't members. But really -- I didn't understand what the big push was to graduate from seminary. Did this earn you points toward getting into BYU or something? I always felt kind of dumb for not knowing.


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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:05 am 
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MrsDoubtfire wrote:
What is the incentive for going to seminary? I never felt like I had to go more than I felt like it -- maybe because my parents weren't members. But really -- I didn't understand what the big push was to graduate from seminary. Did this earn you points toward getting into BYU or something? I always felt kind of dumb for not knowing.


I am 90% sure it is now a requirement to graduate seminary to attend byu now.


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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 4:46 pm 
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SIMS wrote:
belaja wrote:
Maybe it really is about the money. I mean, if kids are allowed to opt out of release time and do home study or even early morning, they aren't bringing in the same bucks, are they?


Except the money to pay for summer school or zero hour goes entirely to the school district. Not to the church.

I don't know - Belaja might be onto something there. In an area like yours that is so Mormon, the majority of the school officials are likely to be Mormon. Knowing their clientele, they may have seen an easy way to help the school's coffers bulk up. It's a little bit brilliant - and more than a little bit slimy - on their part if that's what they're doing.


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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 5:05 pm 
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Niamh wrote:
SIMS wrote:
belaja wrote:
Maybe it really is about the money. I mean, if kids are allowed to opt out of release time and do home study or even early morning, they aren't bringing in the same bucks, are they?


Except the money to pay for summer school or zero hour goes entirely to the school district. Not to the church.

I don't know - Belaja might be onto something there. In an area like yours that is so Mormon, the majority of the school officials are likely to be Mormon. Knowing their clientele, they may have seen an easy way to help the school's coffers bulk up. It's a little bit brilliant - and more than a little bit slimy - on their part if that's what they're doing.


Well, maybe. We just lost a principal of many years that was most definitely NOT mormon. However, the new principal is most definitely a TBM. I'm not sure what the status of those higher up in the hierarchy are.

Personally, I think it's a test to see who is most willing to be super righteous and do whatever is asked of them. Even if it means coughing up $350 per year per child. And yes, graduation from seminary is a requirement to go to BYU or the school formerly known as Ricks. If you live in this area, and probably most of Utah and Idaho, that means you must do seminary as release time. Everywhere else in the country it is early morning. I'm just not sure any other school district in our area forces it completely as release time- especially when the credit requirements are so high.

Luckily, it appears that none of our kids will be doing seminary at all.

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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:03 am 
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Mrs. D., I think the seminary requirement at BYU came after we were out of there. But I know that my parents got their panties in a HUGE bunch when my brother and I balked about going to seminary. They were really harsh about it, like they almost panicked when we resisted at all. We were their oldest and only a year apart, so they may have just been making their "mistakes" on us. FL stopped going after her sophomore year and I don't know if Rippy ever went at all. And they didn't seem that fussed about it.

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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:44 am 
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SIMS wrote:


Luckily, it appears that none of our kids will be doing seminary at all.


Hey, that's great...it means that for the church to follow policy you won't lose them to BYU, Inc. either! Seminary's loss is you and your kids' win. Forever! :thumbsup:


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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:49 am 
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leftofcentre wrote:
SIMS wrote:

Luckily, it appears that none of our kids will be doing seminary at all.

Hey, that's great...it means that for the church to follow policy you won't lose them to BYU, Inc. either! Seminary's loss is you and your kids' win. Forever! :thumbsup:

You have no idea how happy this knowledge makes me. The interesting thing is my son who is in HS right now has several LDS friends that absolutely hate seminary. They are so envious that he does not have to go. Don't think my dh didn't try. When my son was a freshman, dh tried several high dollar bribes to get him to sign up, but son didn't take the bait.

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 Post subject: Re: Paying for Seminary
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:42 am 

Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 5:00 pm
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My children HATE seminary. They can't wait to be 18 so they can tell Dad they are done.

Of all the things in the church, seminary has caused my kids to kick out. They hate getting up at 4:30 AM, going to bed by 9PM, and trying to stay awake for a boring, however kind, teacher. I think my kids might have coasted through being a nonthinking mormon, but for early morning seminary.

I don't care if my kids don't want to be mormon, and I've clued hubby in to the concept they are 'done' once they are of age and no longer under his forced march out the door. None of them want to attend BYU, and I have no desire to push them into such a controlled environment.


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