Further Light and Knowledge

I want to ask a question that I've asked on the NOM board:

I'm really debating when/how to break the news to my folks that I don't believe anymore.

Some background - as you may or may not know, I'm currently in the bishopric. I believe I will be officially released this Sunday (after some pretty tough interactions with my SP - you can read about that in other posts).

My mom and dad are both BIC, TBM, iron rod, etc. Dad has served on HC, bishopric, etc. etc. Mom has mid to late stage parkinsons. She is pretty disabled and pretty fragile. She is also very dependent on her belief system. When two of my brothers went inactive (for what I believe are non intellectual reasons), my mother and father were broken. They are currently serving a service mission in this area and they wish they could be serving a full-time proselyting mission, but mom's health just won't allow it.

After reading and hearing so much advice that sometimes it is better to go slow with how you tell people, and let them know in the process that you are "struggling" with your testimony, I have seriously considered speaking with my dad, alone, to tell him that I have some concerns about J.S., and just leave it at that for now. I may even invite him to read Bushman with me so that he knows that I still rely on him for guidance (I think this can help him feel that I am not abandoning him and mom).

I think I would ask him to keep it from mom, but I don't know if that is fair or not. I know it would hurt my dad just as deeply if I left the church altogether, but I think it might kill my mom. Really. I'm not joking or overreacting. That Parkinsons is pretty tough stuff and she does not handle stress well at all. She can break out into a month of trembling worse than normal, etc.

So on the other hand I am considering just keeping it all in between me and my wife (and of course my PH leaders who are already in the know). I just don't think that is sustainable and if my parents are going to find out eventually, I'd rather it be directly from me in a way that I can soften the blow.

I'm thinking saying "Dad, I'm struggling with my testimony of Joseph Smith. I've always had some small concerns, but the polygamy thing is really causing me some doubts. What do you think about that?... I spoke with my bishop about my concerns and that it might make sense for me to be released from the bishopric. He suggested I speak with the SP, which I did, and he agreed. They are going to release me this Sunday. Keep me in your prayers. I've really been trying to have a testimony of truth..."

I don't know, something like that. That way, a year from now, it won't be the biggest shock in the world if I am less than active.

I definitely would not show up and start trying to convince him of anything. I would never do that. This would be only to give him an idea that I'm not as TBM as he thinks.

I mean, put yourself in his shoes. I'm young (somewhere between 29 and 34, lets say). Based on the look on their faces when they come to my ward, they are pretty darn proud of their son being in the bishopric. If I were to just up and leave, they would figure I was an adulterer. I know it.

You won't know how they'll react, and it will take you a while to fathom how they process anything you say.

So -- slow is good.

I've never came out and told my parents that I don't believe it any more. But then, my parents really aren't as TBM as most. I think they go just because that's what their culture is. I'm pretty obviously not following the WOW and since I've never been through the temple I wear tank tops and such, but they haven't discussed anything church related with me for about 14 years, since I moved 2 states away.

Sometimes I think it is best to just not broach the subject, especially with uber TBM family, but that doesn't always work if you live near them. Given your Mom's health issues, I would keep it between you and your DW unless asked directly, and then I'd say as little as possible.

If you do choose to say anything (though I am with HMM on not talking about it, which I never do with my family), I like the idea you have about framing it in a way that leaves the faith door wide open and just puts you in a 'tough time' episode, instead of an 'I'm leaving to sin' situation. Good luck!

Well I am in the same boat as you. I am married with five kids and we have been totally inactive for over five years now. I am somewhat out to one of my brothers. And I am very vocal about my opinion on issues like prop 8. My family probably just think that I am a "liberal" etc. I am not silent about my views but I don't go around saying that I am an apostate etc. I have decided though to be honest if I am asked direct questions about my beliefs. I too really don't want to hurt my parents. But I am sure that they suspect that something going on as I have not baptized my younger children. My mother would sometime tell me to get them baptized but I would just say that I would think about it. They have never asked me directly why I have not baptized them. My parents sound similar to yours but my father has always been one to try not to butt his nose into other people's business. So maybe that is why they have not pushed the issue. I sometimes just want to tell my whole family but I don't want to hurt them and I really don't think that my story would bring any of them out of the church it would only harm our relationship. Now I have to admit that living in Japan is an advantage, I really don't see than too often but I call them a lot especially my parents. We have a good relationship and I don't want to destroy or harm it. So I have decided that if they ask I will tell them but I don't plan to out myself especially to my parents. They are older and I think it will just do more harm then good.

I would also like to say that I am glad that I left the church. It has caused some distruption in my family in some ways because I had to go through a revaluation of my beliefs in mid parenthood and so some of my values and beliefs changed. So the children went from a strict TBM life to a different life. It is ok to drink coffee or green tea when you visit some one(the culture here in Japan). But I think the sacrifice will be worth it for them and their children in the long run. So what my advice is that you have a responsibility to your wife and children first and so leaving is more important than staying just to make your extended family happy. So you can leave and not tell them if that is possible. Or if you want to tell them I think it is best to go slow and only tell them what is necessary. For example I man am basically an atheist but I would not just blurt that out to my mother. I would just let her know of some of the problems I have with the church etc.

Well enough for now. Plus my hands are cramping from typing on my iPad.

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Steve in Awaji.

For me telling the truth was a simple but somewhat difficult decision. I knew the organization wasn't true and felt disgusted with myself for pretending, for going along with the scam. I knew this was a nightmare that had to end.

I possessed absolute zero uncertainty of the truth about the organization and one morning I told my TBM wife I was never going back to church. Prior to that I had been dropping the usual hints "This doesn't make sense to me - what do you think?" type of dialog but I was always, always shunned and nearly abhorred for thinking outside the steel metal box of strict mormon theocracy. So, I just told her - the first Thursday morning in October a few years ago (four?).

Yes, of course it's been hell at times since I told her that but I have never regretted telling her - never. My only regret was waiting so long to do so.

Sure, the wake of destruction (ha) following my decision was not easy but in retrospect, those uncomfortable situations and feelings were absolutely nothing compared to the constant inner anguish I experienced by pretending to be part of something I knew was wrong, an institution that clearly cheated and lied to me.

I still loathe the organization and have no respect for those who control it - none. The men comprising the Q15 boldly claim their false priesthood and authority while making no apologies as they rape the minds of their victims and hold hostage their follower's abilities to think reasonably, while they continue to demand the total financial, time and emotional resources of their followers. Greedy only begins to describe the Q15, the propagators of deceit.

Do it - tell them all - eventually, they may embrace truth and become like you, cherishing your bold and noble effort to be honest and set an example for them to follow. Most likely, and depending on your story explaining why you are leaving (the truth about the organization was discovered) your TBM family members will continue to choose to follow the organization because the pressures are in place to keep their temple covenants "or they will be in Satan's power." Ya, exactly how a true and loving god would coerce - er, I mean lovingly encourage - his children to follow.

Sorry to ramble - it's therapeutic for me.

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It's good to talk about these things and to sort out the messed up mindfuck we were in.
- SIMS

IMHO these issues are about boundaries, not faith, salvation or values.
Boundaries.
Bottom line is that the way others react is their business and they own it, not you.
It's not an easy place to get ourselves into, where we let others own their actions, but when we get there, it sure is worth it.
As you know, the NOM site has good information on boundaries.

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CW

The universe likes to laugh at us

Any tips on how to make sure the boundaries are healthy? I told my parents today that I'm "struggling" with my testimony of J.S. for various reasons. My name is already in the temple, my dad is offering to give me a father's blessing, and they are fasting for me, and telling me that they are "distraught"...ugh. I hate it. I hate feeling like I'm making other people disappointed.

I've been through this, both with my parents and with my wife's parents.

My advice: be vague. *DO NOT* ever get into any specifics. Play along. Be nice. They'll eventually give up on the reactivation efforts. It's not about being dishonest with them -- it's just not a subject that you discuss in anything but the most nebulously vague terms possible. Focus on talk about feelings as a means of redirecting doctrinal disagreements; state that you may not know all of the answers but you're pretty happy with [whatever your activity level is]. Change the subject frequently.

In my opinion it may be more merciful to allow them some hope for your salvation than to convince them that you're forever lost.

Edited to fix typo.

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Nèg fè, nèg defè. -- Haitian proverb

I just re-read your original post, and the thought that occurs to me is: ¨Why are you obligated to tell them ANYTHING?¨

Sounds like that cat is already out of the bag, though, so to speak.

Just tell yourself that over and over again: you have no obligation to tell them the extent of your apostasy.

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Nèg fè, nèg defè. -- Haitian proverb

I had made the decision several years ago not to devolge information to my parents and extended family than I had too. I would answer a direct question honestly, but I didn’t feel the need to rock the boat with my parents by a full disclosure. This plan worked well for a coupe of years.

As my parents and siblings started to sense that we (wife and I) were becoming less devote, they started to ask questions and then went all missionary on our asses. I finally snapped after getting one too many father Lehi call to repentance letters from my dad. I sent my dad a copy of Rough Stone Rolling and let everyone know that we no longer believed, and gave some of the reasons why.

It did not go well, and for a year, my parents had little to do us. But I felt boundaries had to be set. In hindsight this was a good thing for me, and while it did take a year or so for me to build up a new relationship with my parents, it is much more honest.

I sort of look at removing all hope from my parents as the more merciful thing to do, and the best thing to do in terms of creating a relationship with them going forward. I wanted them to know exactly what my position was (though not necessarily any of the specifics as to why, since I have no desire to mess with the cherished beliefs of old people who are completely culturally immersed in mormonism) and I wanted them to know when I had my name removed. I wanted to rip the band aid off, get the ugly stuff over with as quickly as possible, and get on with it from there. It's been ugly and hard, not going to lie about that. But they're now starting to re-categorize me, rewrite their own narrative about me. I try to make my interactions with them as positive as possible within that framework, and it's been getting better.

I don't think it could get better without that frank disclosure and the resulting closure, painful as that has been for everyone.

Your mom's health is obviously a complication that needs serious consideration. Just make sure you're considering your health as well. It's worth at least as much.